Improving Your Digital Marketing Strategy and Creating Value With Clients with Jason Osborn

This week, Eric Dickmann interviews Jason Osborn. Jason, is a highly accomplished speaker, coach, and consultant in the fields of digital marketing and mindset. Jason established himself as a life coach, back in 2009 and built his online personal development business and within 18 months was making a full-time income form with clients in 13 countries worldwide. Following this success, he switched gears and became an online marketing consultant and has since become a highly sought after coach and adviser. Headhunted by The Re-Think Academy in 2018, Jason is Head Coach and is steering the company towards becoming the #1 coaching program in the UK.

 Eric Dickmann can be found on Twitter @EDickmann and LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/edickmann and my website https://ericdickmann.com

Jason Osborn can be found online at https://www.leftclickrightclick.com/ on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonaosborn/, and Instagram @leftclick_rightclick

Episode Summary: The episode summary can be found at https://fiveechelon.com/rethink-digital-marketing-strategy-s3e17/

If you'd like to contact us with feedback or guest inquiries, please visit:
https://fiveechelon.com/podcast

For more information about Virtual CMO strategic marketing consulting services, visit The Five Echelon Group at https://fiveechelon.com
 
Episode #48

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Transcript

Carla: 0:01

The Virtual CMO podcast is sponsored by the strategic marketing consulting services of The Five Echelon Group. If you’d like to work directly with The Five Echelon Group and receive personal coaching and support to optimize your business, enhance your marketing effectiveness and grow your revenue, visit Five Echelon.com to learn more and schedule a free consultation.

Eric Dickmann: 0:24

Welcome to The Virtual CMO podcast. I'm your host, Eric Dickmann. In this podcast, we have conversations with marketing professionals who share the strategies, tactics, and mindset you can use to improve the effectiveness of your marketing activities and grow your business. this week, I'm excited to welcome Jason Osborne to the show. Jason is a highly accomplished speaker, coach and consultant in the fields of digital marketing and mindset. Jason established himself as a life coach back in 2009 and built his personal development business. And within 18 months was making full-time income with clients in over 13 countries. Following the success. He switched gears and became an online marketing consultant and has since become a highly sought after coach and advisor head hunted by rethink Academy in 2018. Jason is now the head coach and his steering, the company towards becoming the number one coaching program in the United Kingdom. Please welcome Jason to the show. jason welcome to the virtual CMO podcast. I'm glad you could join us today.

Jason Osborn: 1:28

Hey, Eric. It's great to be here, man. It's my pleasure.

Eric Dickmann: 1:31

I always like to start out these as most podcasts do, just getting a little background on you as a guest. And one thing I found interesting in reading your backstory as is that a young age, you got bitten by the entrepreneurial bug, like so many, do I think you hope we started selling sweets or candies? Give us a little bit of history in terms of how you got started as an entrepreneur and how you ended up today as a business coach.

Jason Osborn: 1:57

Yeah, sure thing. So, um, I I've, I've always been really interested in, in, uh, in business just in general. I didn't come, I'd come from an entrepreneurial family or anything like that. And I was in middle school, middle school, and it didn't come from. Uh, you know, a wealthy family at all and quite the opposite we were struggling to get by. And I just thought, you know what, I'm just going to go figure this out myself, you know? So, um, I I'd heard of some other kids that were doing. You know, selling candy and stuff like that. So I thought, well, I can do this. So I just went out. Bought a pack of stuff and just thought, well, here we go. So on breaks or at lunch or whatever. I'd go around and sell it. And people are buying it. I couldn't believe it. And so it just kind of build up belts and belts and belts, and I was doing pretty well. Um, then of course teachers got wind of it and, um, Didn't last too long after that, which. Which I think is disappointing, you know? I understand one side, I guess you have to be protective of maybe a edible type of things that you're selling on a school campuses, but, um, I in my personal opinion, I think it'd be great. If there was more, a kind of entrepreneurial. Encouragement at schools to be able to help kids really. If, if they, if there's a kid that really has that spark or shown to be kind of entrepreneurial, how teachers can kind of. Build that up and encourage that. Um, so I never, I never really lost the bug of it, but it just was quite disappointed, you know? Cause I was like, why are you shutting me down? But yeah, it was really good. I love, I love doing it.

Eric Dickmann: 3:26

I remember when I did my first lemonade stand and started to realize that, there is money to be made in business if you know the basics. So you've come a long way since those early entrepreneurial adventures. And now you're a business coach. Talk a little bit about what you do today.

Jason Osborn: 3:43

Yeah. So today, uh, what I do, I do two things with my company. The first thing is I'm contracted out with the rethink Academy, uh, which is a, a large social media training agency. And we have hundreds of clients that come through every year through our training programs. From starting up a online businesses from scratch all the way to businesses that have been around for 20, 30 years, but they're just wanting to learn how to market themselves better online. Um, and then my kind of speciality is LinkedIn showing people how to. Use LinkedIn, which is probably the most misunderstood and underutilized platform out there at the moment. But how do you use that to really generate leads in business from the platform? So, yeah, it's a big transition. It was a journey to get to this place right now. But, uh, but I love doing it because I love coaching. I love helping people through that process. I just get a kick out of seeing clients get results as well, which is pretty cool.

Eric Dickmann: 4:36

We're going to drill down into Rethink a little bit more and also this whole idea around LinkedIn and how to generate more leads from it. But before we go there, I'd love to know. Have you had a mentor along your journey, somebody who has really helped you in terms of developing out your own entrepreneurial and marketing skills?

Jason Osborn: 4:54

Yeah, few actually. Um, so a part of it is just, you know, when your, um, when. When I was growing up, I loved kind of business as we were talking earlier. So going through that process of being around other people that were in business. So one of'em. Some of my friends growing up, their dad was quite entrepreneurial and I hung out a lot with him. Um, I worked in a company when I was probably 19. Um, that, uh, they, they were good friends of mine as well, but they own the business. And so they would let me kind of go out with them on business meetings and things. So I was able to be around people that. Uh, supported me and encouraged me through that process of being an entrepreneur. And then I've hired coaches as well have hired mentors. I have a mentor now. Uh, that are higher and pay. So yeah, it's, it's something, in my opinion, you just ha you have to have.

Eric Dickmann: 5:49

That's interesting because we're living in this time of COVID. A lot of people are changing professions. A lot of people are working from home is solo preneurs. So, what do you think makes a good business coach or a mentor?

Jason Osborn: 6:03

Alright, well, one, I think it's about someone that is able to explain things in a simple process. Uh, I have been around. Or heard business coaches, they over-complicate things. And I think that's the first thing if it's over complicated. So it's not as simple process, it makes it really challenging to really listen to them. For me personally, I like to be around people that have also experienced and done it themselves. So it doesn't mean that there aren't people out there that can't be, be helpful or advantageous to your business. But when I personally go out and look for a coach, I am looking for a particular element in my business or in myself. So whether that's my mindset or things that I need to change in the way that I work that has an. A benefit to my business and life. I'm looking okay. Oh, At a coastal County, this is the specific thing I'm looking to achieve. Who has been out there and done that, or has helped people achieve those similar types of results. So for me, that's, what I look for is, is. Proof that they've been able to accomplish that before.

Eric Dickmann: 7:07

I think that's a really good point because I think there are a lot of people who are in the coaching business who really don't have all that much life experience. They've got a lot of enthusiasm for the kinds of. Things that they want to help people with, but they don't necessarily have the background and experience. And I think you have to be careful when you're hiring coaches to make sure that they are offering something that is truly going to be a benefit to you.

Jason Osborn: 7:29

Yeah, absolutely. And there's, you know, There's always a start. Right? You have to start somewhere. So if you're starting off, whether it's a business coach or any type of product or service that you're promoting, you always have your first client, your first customer. So there there's a starting point, but one of the things that, that I teach when we go in and help clients is if you're going into a market that you haven't worked in before. So if you're a coach or whatever, You know, going into it and look at how you can add value first. And now it might mean either having really reduced prices or do beta testers, better clients. That potentially, even for free that you work through that process and help them get results. A lot of people get frustrated by that because I think, Oh no, I came in, I'd make money. And now you're telling me not to charge or whatever. It's like, Yeah, that's such a short term mentality looking at it that way, you know, because you need that social proof. You need to be able to help people through that process. And I have some really good friends that have been very successful in particular niche or niche, depending on where you are in the country or the world. Um, and they have changed their, their niche. And they, so while they would have been really successful charging, really good money on area, they will actually go in CRE have beta testers will do something for free because they want to validate that process have clients on there. And they do it in exchange for a video testimonial so that they have is social proof. And then when they actually go and start charging it, they're not saying, well, I haven't done this before, but I want to charge you$5,000 or pounds, whatever. And people like client, you've never done this and you want to charge me that much. I'm not To be your, your, your Guinea pig on this. So, um, yeah, there's so there was always a starting point, but for me, you know, I, I, I'm kind of. Uh, without trying to sound egotistical or anything, but, you know, at this point I want to work with people that have, have had that experience and the proof to back that up as well.

Eric Dickmann: 9:21

It's a great point though, because everybody has to start somewhere and offering those proof points, offering maybe a different way to sort of engage with somebody or in a new industry for the first time, but providing something of value that, that can then give them the comfort level that they need to make that engagement happen. I think that's great advice because like I said, a lot of people have to start somewhere.

Jason Osborn: 9:43

Absolutely.

Eric Dickmann: 9:44

so you're the head coach here at Rethink Academy? Talk to me a little bit about what coaching looks like in that business. Is it one-on-one coaching is a group classes. Is it online? How do you coach your clients?

Jason Osborn: 9:57

So mainly what we do. It's more of a group, um, element that we do. We have training sessions once per week. Um, and we have things built up within kind of phases where we take people through a, we kind of call them sprints so that we are able to focus on something. Um, because what we used to do is have something built out over a six or nine month period of time. But when you get started the very beginning six, nine months, that feels like a long time. And so what we do now is we have sprints where we're looking to achieve specific objectives and outcomes or, or teach certain things. Uh, well, obviously we can't make our clients do the work, but we have certain things that we teach within that timeframe. To be able to help them. And then we have group masterminds as well. So we're able to get in and we have specific tasks each week that they're supposed to be working on in accomplishing. And then we have a, a, a Q and a mastermind each week as well, to be able to go over that do share screens and all that sort of stuff to help clients through that process. And of course we're there for them in between those sessions too, for them to swim, you know? Quote unquote, their homework or tasks or whatever for review, and really help them through that process. And it's great because having a very structured training, here's what you need to do then each week. Do you have questions around that? And you have access to the coaches in between those sessions. It's really powerful and we're seeing some incredible results with our clients as well. Um, you know, people that are just starting off. You know, that are getting business and earning a full-time income or, you know, in between kind of three and six months, period of time, which is pretty good. And obviously can't guarantee that, but we're seeing those types of results come through, which is pretty cool.

Eric Dickmann: 11:36

Hey, it's Eric here and we'll be right back to the podcast. But first, are you ready to grow, scale, and take your marketing to the next level? If so, The Five Echelon Group's Virtual CMO onsulting service may be a great fit for you. We can help build a strategic marketing plan for your business and manage its execution, step-by-step. We'll focus on areas like how to attract more leads. How to create compelling messaging that resonates with your ideal customers. How to strategically package and position your products and services. How to increase lead conversion, improve your margins, and scale your business. To find out more about our consulting offerings and schedule a consultation, go to fiveechelon.com and click on Services. Now back to the podcast. I want to get into your methodology a little bit. And obviously during this short podcast, we're not going to be able to do it justice, but I really like, the topics that you're going into, because I see so much of this in my own consulting practice when I talk with various businesses. So you've got this rethink methodology and you start out by talking about, finding the right niche for your business and over and over again, I see with It's that they're too broad that they're going after too big a market segment, and they may have a great product or service. But they're too afraid to give up anything. And so they try to go after it all and ended up getting very little of it. Talk to me a little bit about the importance of finding the right niche.

Jason Osborn: 13:05

Uh, I lo I love this. So yes, it's something that we come across all the time as well. So, um, The importance of not only the right knee, but also what you said on narrowing down and becoming a specialist in your area. And there's different variations of that. But the thing that I always refer back to you and I talked about this with our clients all the time is you want to remove yourself from a commodity market, which is what most people do they go in. They say, I'm a life coach. I'm a business coach. I'm a marketing. Uh, agency or, you know, whatever it is, even one of our clients is an independent financial advisor. You know, an accountant or whatever, it becomes so broad where people will instantaneously make a snap judgment based on what you do and the services you provide based on how you label. You'll see yourself. And most people put themselves in a commodity market. The, the, probably the best one that I can, uh, just as an example, as a personal trainer. Everyone knows where to find a personal trainer. When you go there, you ask, and what do they do? They can either help you lose weight or put on muscle mass. Right. Simple. We know they're going to do that. So what's the next question. How much do you charge? And so that's how you, how much they charge per session or per hour or whatever it is. So, what do you do you go to the next personal trainer because you want to start saying, okay, well, who do I like. And who's the cheapest. Okay. And we probably won't go with the cheapest would probably go with the one right above the cheapest, because we don't want to feel like we're cheap. But we were basing it on price. And that's what a lot of people do is they put themselves in a commodity based market because of how they position themselves. And then they compete on price. So a personal trainer just saying, Hey, I can, I can help you lose weight. Well, so can every other personal trainer. So what makes that personal trainer different? Where if you position yourself saying, look, I help athletes. To get into peak. Performance. Within 90 days, assuming that's possible. I'm not a personal trainer. So I don't know if that's actually possible, but that all of a sudden you positioned yourself very, very differently in the market, because if you're an athlete, you're going to go, Oh, okay. That's me. You helped me. And you can help me get in. Peak performance, which is a very tangible, specific outcome. As opposed to a life coach saying, Hey, I can help you reach your dreams. What does that mean? And he, and a timeframe you can help me do that in 90 days, or maybe it's, you know, 120 days or whatever. But all of a sudden, because of that positioning. I know that I'm getting something very, very tangible. And if I were an athlete, Looking to get into peak performance within that timeframe. Yes, there is an element of price, but are more. Concerned about the outcome. And if I know that that person, that personal trainer can help me achieve that outcome, I will be willing to pay more for that. So it's a huge, huge thing that people need to understand how to find the right niche. And then also are we. Uh, to, to move into the element, which is evaluating your avatar and how to position yourself. So those two things are really, really important. Um, when you're we either, whether you're starting off in business or even a few business, been in business for a while, um, oftentimes with clients that have been in business for five, 10, 15 years, when I start asking them these questions to really start fine tuning. Okay. Well, what makes you different from everyone else? The mind goes blank. And I'm surprised. You've probably seen this as well, but it's like, you've been in business for how long, and you don't know this. So, but it's one of those things that I look at it from a positive, because once you land that once I can help a client understand that. It changes their whole positioning in the market. Um, and, and it's just amazing. And one of the things we can chat about if you'd like is just that whole kind of fear based around going so broad and, and, and why people don't narrow down, which I see a lot of people they're just afraid to do it.

Eric Dickmann: 16:58

Are afraid of giving up business. Right? You talked about, that second element, the E, which is really understanding your customers, target persona or avatar. And I think what a lot of businesses miss is that they're not giving up anything. What they're actually doing is they're providing a focus and that focus is going to allow them to use their marketing budget, the tools that they have available to effectively go after a market, as opposed to just casting such a wide net, that it's completely ineffective.

Jason Osborn: 17:28

Yeah. Yeah. And it's completely fear based, as you said, they're, they're afraid to lose business. And one of the things that I always find really interesting around this. Is, you know, I'll see things and you'll see this particularly on LinkedIn, because it's how people kind of put their headlines around what they do. But they'll say things like, you know, I'm a life coach, a business coach, strategist, hypnotherapist, and horse whisper, and you, and you're going. What, what, what do you do? And it becomes confusing. And I say, well, you know what, what's the one thing you want to do? What, what do you love doing? What do you make the most money at? What's you know, all of these types of questions. And they go. Yeah. But what about that person? I, you know, I could help them with this. And so what happens is people are so afraid, as you said, they don't want to lose business and always ask them. Okay. Well, how many people have asked you to do that? We'll know what. So they're trying to market themselves and it's based out of fear because if you have a steady stream of leads, And clients coming your way. You're not worried about that potential person that might want that one thing that you learned how to do 15 years ago. That you, you can charge for because you're not desperate. You're positioning yourself in a way where you're reaching your ideal prospect. So, yeah, I think we're definitely on the same page with that.

Eric Dickmann: 18:46

Well, and how many businesses have been derailed? Because they took a client. They took a customer that was wrong, really for what they did or for their product or service. And it ended up being sort of a nightmare engagement. you hear stories about that all the time.

Jason Osborn: 18:59

Oh, yeah, yeah. All the time. And, and th this. The other thing around that is the better the clients you bring on board that are very specific on what you're able to help them deal with and the problem you're helping them to solve the better clients you have. And it's just an all around. It's a better service you're able to provide and they're, your client is satisfied with you more as well. So yeah. So the more specific, the better, in my opinion.

Eric Dickmann: 19:26

So this, you get into that next element of your process, which is like targeting the right traffic. So this is really where you take that niche, that target customer, and then you execute a marketing strategy against it.

Jason Osborn: 19:37

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Because every, every target market is going to be on dif different places. So understanding of how to target them. And we're talking about online. You know, if you're doing business to business, LinkedIn is a great platform for that. If you're doing business consumer, then things like Facebook and Instagram are probably going to be better platforms. Now, does that mean you can't sell business to business on LinkedIn? No, but it's more challenging. And can you sell business to business on Instagram and Facebook? Yes, you can. But your target market, your decision makers are on LinkedIn. So understanding not only how to target them on the platform is, but what's going to. Entice them to actually, as we were talking earlier, take up something of value from you so that they can be engaged with you. You can start that whole process of generating lead from them. So you're targeting the right traffic is really, really important.

Eric Dickmann: 20:29

And that whole idea of giving them something of value, I think is critical as well. We're in this age of tremendous content generation where people are offering all BS. things for free on their website, on a YouTube channel like we're doing today on the podcast, but it's still not surprising to run into a business that wants you to sign up for things before they will even give you the smallest amount of content. And that just doesn't seem to be the best way to go about it.

Jason Osborn: 20:57

No, no, no, absolutely not. The more that people can know, like, and trust you. And that's something that obviously a lot of marketers know about is that whole know, like, and trust element. But having something that you're able to do, which goes into the Hage part, the age part of the rethink has helped for free. So you're going in giving them something of value. And. The thing that a lot of people I see do here is they, they scammed around the edges around this stuff. They just say, well, what can I give a free that's the smallest, the least amount of effort. But what does your prospect think about that? Like, if what they're getting for you from free is the smallest bit that you can possibly help them on and they don't feel. Like, what you're doing is really adding value to them. Or it's so generic or so bland. That is also a reflection of the perceived value that they think that they're going to continue to get from you if you are working with them longterm. So that doesn't mean to give away the form. It doesn't mean to give everything because obviously, you know, you have you're in business. You need to make money. You need to make a profit. But you want them to be able to have something of value from them, from you that they really get a sense of how well you're going to be able to help them. If they do move forward and pay you for your product or your service.

Eric Dickmann: 22:21

One of the things that you talk about or make reference to in the methodology as well is once you've made that sale. Go for the immediate upsell. And that was an interesting thing because I've seen similar methodologies, but this is the first time that I've actually seen this as really as part of one of the methodologies. Talk a little bit about why you feel that upsell so important.

Jason Osborn: 22:40

Well, it, it's what we call people in the yes. State. So when you have someone that, whether it's an ad on Facebook or piece of content, or they've seen something on. Instagram or LinkedIn or wherever when, when they go and they click on something. To learn more. That's a yes. Right. Cause it could have said no, they could've kept scrolling and they could have moved on. They could have switched off their phone, whatever. So something that moves them more in the direction of your overall funnel is a yes. When they get to your landing page or your website and they fill in a form to get your free whatever, or to book in a call with you or whatever that case may be. That's a yes. And so they're in this yes. State of wanting more information. And so when you get that element of them saying, okay, here, I'll put my name and email address to receive your free gift, whatever that might be. And it goes onto that. Thank you page. Now they're in that yes. State because they want to know more information. And so if you're able to provide something to them, a value. To say, look, if you want more information now, yes, you've got the free stuff that's coming in right now to your inbox. But if you want something now that can help you more. Here is an offer 40, and that could be a, you know, kind of a low ticket product draw for that. You have, um, it could even be an affiliate product that you're promoting out that you get a commission on. But having that. People in that? Yes, state. They're more likely to purchase because if not think about what you're doing then is they're getting disrupted. In their life. Because. Yes, they put their name and email address in, but for them to then go into their email, they may be distracted. Something might happen and then it could get lost in the email. They could forget they've even signed up, which a lot of marketers like. A lot of marketers are surprised when, when they're first starting off, like peop they've just signed up now they're emailing me, telling them I'm spamming when they sign up for us. Like yeah. Cause people just forget. And so IE. If you're relying on just simply your free product, that your free gift or whatever it is, your email. Then you have to reengage them into a yes. State again, where the immediate upsell they're already in that yesterday. So there's a likelihood of them purchasing something from you straight away, which is really cool.

Eric Dickmann: 25:06

One of the things that I love about marketing and it's good and bad in some ways, but we have so many buying intent signals, right? With all these tools, we can now really track what people are doing and understand what their intent was. I'll give you a great example. And this is honestly the first time that I'd seen this. I was shopping earlier for, some clothes, a new pair of pants, and I'd been on several different websites looking at this. And then just earlier this morning, I was on Instagram. And every other post on Instagram was the same company. And with a different picture from their catalog of things. And I'd never seen something where the same companies. A message was repeated every other post. You know, I've seen them pop up frequently, but never like that, but they knew I'd been shopping on a couple other sites by buying intent signals were very strong and they were going to capitalize on that moment for those impressions to put that in front of me, as often as they could. I thought that was really interesting.

Jason Osborn: 26:03

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it's, it's a good thing. It feels a little bit scary. Sometimes. I think all of us have been in that. That place where I don't know if it's they actually do their snob, but where we've just mentioned something and, you know, talking to our partner or whatever. And next thing you know, we go into our, our cell phone and. Lo and behold there's theirs. An ad for the very thing we're talking about. So, uh, you know, I don't know. It. People have different opinions on it, if that actually happens or not, but it feels like that way, but yeah, you want to make sure that you capitalize on people's buying intentions for sure.

Eric Dickmann: 26:36

Yeah, there's a lot of privacy concerns, obviously that we have to deal with. as a society, as marketers, but there's part of me that really feels like I'd much rather see products and services that were of interest to me than see a bunch of things that were completely irrelevant. And so there definitely is a trade off. So as we get to the end of your methodology here, let's just go through these last two steps, which were a nurturing the relationship and knowing your numbers.

Jason Osborn: 27:01

Yeah. Yeah. So nurturing is really important because a lot of people, they want the immediate upsell, uh, but going in and actually nurturing your list. Adding continued. Uh, value to them is very, very important because not everyone's going to want to purchase straightaway, even like what you did looking for your pair of pants. I don't know if you bought anything, but you went in, you looked, you researched, you looked at that and you're in the process of deciding on whether or not you actually want to purchase something. So by them, Providing more ads to you. Now, if you'd sign up for something and you're able, they're able to then send emails to you about promotions coming up or whatever the case may be, that is just continue value in that they're providing to you. So nerd journey, your list along that. That process showing them that you can continue to add value to them. Is really, really important. And then knowing your numbers. And this is where a lot of people, I think fall short is they don't know what their, their conversion rates are. They don't know what their numbers are. They don't know how many people come to their landing page. And then what the conversion rate is of people signing up to how many people purchase to how many people buy the upsells or upgrades to that. Um, how many, you know, what's the lifetime value of your customer? So if you have someone that's come in and bought a$50 products, well, what's the lifetime value of, of that, that, uh, that customer to you. And so knowing those numbers are really, really key. If you don't know your numbers, you don't know what to improve. You don't know what can grow and. You'll fall shore, uh, from massive potential in your business. If you don't know your numbers.

Eric Dickmann: 28:41

Couldn't agree more with all the tools that we have, the analytics that, a lot of these tools provide. There's really no excuse for not knowing your numbers, but you have to know what numbers you need to be tracking as well, and make sure that the data going in is good because numbers. Are only as good as the data that you put in, right.

Jason Osborn: 28:58

Yo. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And there's some great tracking tool tools and, you know, obviously Facebook with the Facebook pixel and Google has its own page. Console. And there's loads of tracking tools now that you can use. And. Yeah, but you've got to know your numbers. You've got to look at them and, and make sense and look at where those incremental changes are. Cause that's, that's what, where the real growth comes in is if you're able to increase your lead magnet conversion rate by three or 4%. You know, if you're doing big numbers, that's, that's a lot of difference to your business. And so knowing that is really, really key.

Eric Dickmann: 29:34

Before we wrap up today. I really want to pick your brain a little bit about LinkedIn, because I know you talked about how much you liked LinkedIn as a lead source as a way to make connections. What do you think people are doing wrong on LinkedIn?

Jason Osborn: 29:48

Oh, the, the first thing that people are doing wrong on LinkedIn is trying to sell. Which people go. What's the point of being on LinkedIn. If you're not going to sell. We all get messages now, you know, connection messages that people send a connection request to you and in their connection message, which there's a limited character count on that anyway, but in that short amount of characters, they're just like, Hey, do you want to jump on a call with me? And it's like, well, no, I don't know you. Like, why would I want to communicate with you at all? And why would I want to give my time away to you and that sort of thing. So that's the first thing is definitely just trying to sell to people straight away on, on a connection request, or once you've connected with them since a just full-on sales message to you is just. It turns people off it, they don't want to do business with you and the people that I do see promoting that. Uh, they're just, they're doing massive numbers and they're there. They're P they're given kind of the whole process of bad name on LinkedIn. Um, and I don't see them lasting very long either. They usually just fizzle out because people just don't like working with them. So that's the number one. Uh, thing that I see. That people are making a massive mistake on, on LinkedIn.

Eric Dickmann: 31:06

I get so many messages that say, Oh, we have a number of connections in common. I think we should connect. Well, Y you know, tell me why you think we should connect. What is it other than having a few other connections in common? That is a good reason to connect. Because I'm open to connect with just about anybody, but I'd like to know sort of why you think you would be a good connection for me as well. And I see so many people doing that and I fallen into the trap many times of saying, okay, I'll do that. And then like you said, the very next thing is a form message. That's just a sales pitch for some product or another.

Jason Osborn: 31:38

Yeah. Yeah. And, and there's, there's a balance between that as well. And so there's lots of things that people are. LinkedIn's a different platform than Facebook and Instagram. You know, it's not really a social networking platform, you know, you're not on there to share pictures of what you ate or your holidays or vacations or anything like that. It's a networking platform. And the way that you communicate with people is very different on that. So, you know, there's always a balance. I see the one side people going in for what I call the kill, you know, just that sales message straightaway. And then you have other people, um, because they've heard from other kind of LinkedIn trainers that you should just. Start messaging and create a relationship and all that book. I look at it where that's what I call being friend zoned it, where you just go in and say, Hey, how you doing? How things been going over for you for the last six months during COVID. People kind of go, well, why are you asking me this? You know. Okay. I get it. You're not going in for a sales pitch, grape. But also get to the point as well. So there's this balance and this is what I train a lot is, is how do you find that balance where you're not going in for the kill? But you're not just going into this kind of like asking questions where people just go, Oh, I just can't be bothered with. Replying to you anymore around this. So where's that balance and there's a process. It's a simple process. But, um, yeah, it it's it, once you get that down, though, LinkedIn is a brilliant, brilliant platform to use.

Eric Dickmann: 33:04

Yeah. And as we were discussing a little bit before the call, it has its challenges, right? It's a, it's not moving quite at the same pace at some of the other platforms are moving for sure. But they are enhancing it. They are making it better and giving more tools for people to connect in different ways. And so it's certainly a platform that as a solo preneur, as a business owner, you should be taking advantage of and should have a presence on.

Jason Osborn: 33:25

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. So LinkedIn is growing massive. I think they're adding about two, two new people every second, which is pretty cool. And, uh, I saw, um, actually yesterday that due to all of the COVID stuff to traffic on LinkedIn, as well as increased around. Uh, 2300%, because that's where a lot of people were networking because you couldn't go out and do that sort of networking. So it's a massive, massive platform. And as I agree, if you are a solopreneur entrepreneur or business owner and not using LinkedIn, you're definitely missing out for sure.

Eric Dickmann: 34:00

And I know LinkedIn is your preferred channel for people to get in touch with you. So, if you would tell people what is the best way that they can find you. And also a Rethink Academy.

Jason Osborn: 34:10

Yeah. Sure. So if people want to connect with me, go on LinkedIn. It's Jason A Osborne O S B O R N. Um, and also for Rethink, um, we have, uh, the rethink social media book. Uh, so if you want the first four chapters of that, if you go to rethink gift.com. You can put your name and email address and do exactly what we talked about today. We put your name in an email address and we'll send the first four chapters of that book over to you as well. So you can just look into it, have a read of it and see the amazing value that's in that book for you.

Eric Dickmann: 34:41

Jason, this has been a great conversation. I loved the methodology. I think there's a lot of value there and I hope people will go to the website, check out the first couple chapters of that book and take a look at some of the other training programs that you guys offer, because I think it's spot on.

Jason Osborn: 34:54

Cheers. Thanks, Eric. Appreciate it.

Eric Dickmann: 34:58

Thank you for joining us on this episode of The Virtual CMO podcast. For more episodes, go to fiveechelon.com/podcast to subscribe through your podcast player of choice. And if you'd like to develop consistent lead flow and a highly effective marketing strategy, visit fiveechelon.com to learn more about our Virtual CMO consulting services.